Super-casino attracting more and more interest (From Hampshire Chronicle)

More flats please and an Ice Rink.

Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Please shut up or change the record

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Pointless concrete dog toilet. Build somehting worthwhile on it ASAP.

kingnotail wrote:

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Pointless concrete dog toilet. Build somehting worthwhile on it ASAP.

*something

why do we need more hotels in an area that already has 6 already and more planned
give something that the residents want not the council's rich m8's

Rjhsoton wrote:
why do we need more hotels in an area that already has 6 already and more planned
give something that the residents want not the council's rich m8's

Give something that might actually attract people to visit the city too. There's nothing at present.

Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Rjhsoton wrote:
why do we need more hotels in an area that already has 6 already and more planned
give something that the residents want not the council's rich m8's

Hotels that serve little purpose more than single night stays for cruise passengers.

kingnotail wrote:

Rjhsoton wrote:
why do we need more hotels in an area that already has 6 already and more planned
give something that the residents want not the council's rich m8's

Hotels that serve little purpose more than single night stays for cruise passengers.

I can really picture all the fun that families will now be able to have in this area. A strip club, a super casino and whole lot of drunk people! It's the perfect place for families! And they weren't expecting this, because the Tourist Information Centre is closed.

No more casino,s please, there always half empty anyway, an indoor arena would be nice, and is the council going to ask its public what we want, most people do not want a poxy casino, besides who can afford to throw money anyway, no me.

Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

If we're lucky, Southampton can have the greatest concentration of casinos, bookies, cash-converters and HP stores like Brighthouse in the whole country.
.
Thanks to these fine people's predation on poverty we can then revel in our status as 'UK Capital of Misery'.
.
Much more catchy than that 'City of Culture' nonsense. We could run tours for Emos and Goths!

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

No I just make things up. Mad lies. Either that or I don't live in cloud cuckoo land. Credit check any of the 10 planet ice holding companies. Then tell me how a developer could afford to buy land, build an ice rink and let it to an operator without their bank manager shooting them.
Get in the real world.

what a utter mish mash of a city ,the place is a dump ,left way behind even by the likes of basingstoke.

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

Depends what they are. If it's yet more low quality production line junk then it'll be totally pointless.
.
There are a handful of good (not posh, but decent) independent places in Southampton. Places that do well because word of mouth does their advertising for them - eg Georges, Kali Mirchi, Dock of the Bay. These places should be encouraged and offered incentives to open in the new 'prime' locations, as should well regarded outfits in Winchester, Dorset etc.

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

Depends what they are. If it's yet more low quality production line junk then it'll be totally pointless.
.
There are a handful of good (not posh, but decent) independent places in Southampton. Places that do well because word of mouth does their advertising for them - eg Georges, Kali Mirchi, Dock of the Bay. These places should be encouraged and offered incentives to open in the new 'prime' locations, as should well regarded outfits in Winchester, Dorset etc.

Lets get behind anyone who wants to invest in southampton. West quay phase 3 will have a great line up, seen who they are speaking to and it's spot on. If someone wants to build a super casino then brilliant. Get on with it. Enough armchair moaning. If people don't like it, live elsewhere.

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

No I just make things up. Mad lies. Either that or I don't live in cloud cuckoo land. Credit check any of the 10 planet ice holding companies. Then tell me how a developer could afford to buy land, build an ice rink and let it to an operator without their bank manager shooting them.
Get in the real world.

Since you claim to do this for a living, you must realise that most of the ice rink developers and operators, (including Planet Ice) work with the councils, and lease the land rather than buying, so they can reduce their development costs.
Proactive councils, such as Guildford and Swindon even develop and operate the leisure facilities. In Guildford at the Spectrum Leisure Centre, which has bowling, ice rink and swimming on one site, they regularly do "Child goes free with paying adult" days, and the centre still makes a profit. I believe Swindon is also in profit. Unfortunately, although we have fabulous outdoor leisure areas in Southampton, such as the Sports Centre, Common, central Parks etc there is very little for people, especally families with children to do indoors during the bad weather, which we seem to be increasingly getting.
I am concerned that the focus of all of the recently proposed developments in this City are restaurants, flats and hotels, presumably because they expect us all to be so obese from all of our eating out that we have to waddle to bed nearby!
In the real world, very few restaurants are of the quality to attract visitors from further afield to the city, and Super Casinos are great for occasional big nights out, but would people visiting Southampton to go to the casino spend money anywhere else in the city? I doubt it.
I regularly take my family to Swindon, Basingstoke and Guildford where we can do any number of healthy activities on one site, and the whole family is entertained for a day inside one building. Something like this would give all of the students and young people in the city something better to do than the endless bars they are currently offered.
I think the council should give the contract to Rank and make one of the conditions that they provide an indoor arena that could be used as an ice rink. Now that would be a sweet irony!

elvisimo wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

Depends what they are. If it's yet more low quality production line junk then it'll be totally pointless.
.
There are a handful of good (not posh, but decent) independent places in Southampton. Places that do well because word of mouth does their advertising for them - eg Georges, Kali Mirchi, Dock of the Bay. These places should be encouraged and offered incentives to open in the new 'prime' locations, as should well regarded outfits in Winchester, Dorset etc.

Lets get behind anyone who wants to invest in southampton. West quay phase 3 will have a great line up, seen who they are speaking to and it's spot on. If someone wants to build a super casino then brilliant. Get on with it. Enough armchair moaning. If people don't like it, live elsewhere.

"If people don't like it, live elsewhere."
.
That's the spirit! lol
.
So people should accept their home-town as a sub-mediocre dive, or otherwise just go elsewhere?
.
How defeatist...!
.
Some of us think that this City has a lot of unrealised potential, and would rather make that clear to those in power, than feign pride in a place that has suffered from an utter failure of leadership and vision for many years. The Echo's comments aren't much of a lever, but you'd be mistaken in thinking that people don't communicate their views via other avenues as well.
.
Those that get so irate at seeing Southampton criticised would do better putting their passion into pressuring the decision makers into rectifying things.

Do we really need another Casino? Is it going to attract people from afar?

Casino's tend to attract people who think they have money, until they wake up the next morning with a major hangover and no money for a fry up at Wetherspoons.

Can't Southampton do something decent just for once?

Presumably there is a way to improve facilities in Soton and that is to have referendum as to what the population would like.
Assuming there is a majority, Council funds could then be used to pump prime the investment as Portsmouth Tax payers had to do with the Spinnaker Tower, Liverpool with their Cruise Terminal and Eastleigh with the Cricket Ground investment (altho I don't think any of these had direct public support)
Problem is, I think, we would all have different priorities and there would be many concerned about funds being diverted from essential services

phil maccavity wrote:
Presumably there is a way to improve facilities in Soton and that is to have referendum as to what the population would like.
Assuming there is a majority, Council funds could then be used to pump prime the investment as Portsmouth Tax payers had to do with the Spinnaker Tower, Liverpool with their Cruise Terminal and Eastleigh with the Cricket Ground investment (altho I don't think any of these had direct public support)
Problem is, I think, we would all have different priorities and there would be many concerned about funds being diverted from essential services

How much would a referendum cost? We've been down that road..............

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Go away d*ckhead

cantthinkofone wrote:
If we're lucky, Southampton can have the greatest concentration of casinos, bookies, cash-converters and HP stores like Brighthouse in the whole country.
.
Thanks to these fine people's predation on poverty we can then revel in our status as 'UK Capital of Misery'.
.
Much more catchy than that 'City of Culture' nonsense. We could run tours for Emos and Goths!

You obviously haven't been to the North East - shows how little you know!!

230 repeat please wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

No I just make things up. Mad lies. Either that or I don't live in cloud cuckoo land. Credit check any of the 10 planet ice holding companies. Then tell me how a developer could afford to buy land, build an ice rink and let it to an operator without their bank manager shooting them.
Get in the real world.

Since you claim to do this for a living, you must realise that most of the ice rink developers and operators, (including Planet Ice) work with the councils, and lease the land rather than buying, so they can reduce their development costs.
Proactive councils, such as Guildford and Swindon even develop and operate the leisure facilities. In Guildford at the Spectrum Leisure Centre, which has bowling, ice rink and swimming on one site, they regularly do "Child goes free with paying adult" days, and the centre still makes a profit. I believe Swindon is also in profit. Unfortunately, although we have fabulous outdoor leisure areas in Southampton, such as the Sports Centre, Common, central Parks etc there is very little for people, especally families with children to do indoors during the bad weather, which we seem to be increasingly getting.
I am concerned that the focus of all of the recently proposed developments in this City are restaurants, flats and hotels, presumably because they expect us all to be so obese from all of our eating out that we have to waddle to bed nearby!
In the real world, very few restaurants are of the quality to attract visitors from further afield to the city, and Super Casinos are great for occasional big nights out, but would people visiting Southampton to go to the casino spend money anywhere else in the city? I doubt it.
I regularly take my family to Swindon, Basingstoke and Guildford where we can do any number of healthy activities on one site, and the whole family is entertained for a day inside one building. Something like this would give all of the students and young people in the city something better to do than the endless bars they are currently offered.
I think the council should give the contract to Rank and make one of the conditions that they provide an indoor arena that could be used as an ice rink. Now that would be a sweet irony!

Think about what you write. Operators and developers are two separate entities. No one can afford to build some ing in the current market and then let it to a paper thin covenant like planet ice. Unfundable

cantthinkofone wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

Depends what they are. If it's yet more low quality production line junk then it'll be totally pointless.
.
There are a handful of good (not posh, but decent) independent places in Southampton. Places that do well because word of mouth does their advertising for them - eg Georges, Kali Mirchi, Dock of the Bay. These places should be encouraged and offered incentives to open in the new 'prime' locations, as should well regarded outfits in Winchester, Dorset etc.

Lets get behind anyone who wants to invest in southampton. West quay phase 3 will have a great line up, seen who they are speaking to and it's spot on. If someone wants to build a super casino then brilliant. Get on with it. Enough armchair moaning. If people don't like it, live elsewhere.

"If people don't like it, live elsewhere."
.
That's the spirit! lol
.
So people should accept their home-town as a sub-mediocre dive, or otherwise just go elsewhere?
.
How defeatist...!
.
Some of us think that this City has a lot of unrealised potential, and would rather make that clear to those in power, than feign pride in a place that has suffered from an utter failure of leadership and vision for many years. The Echo's comments aren't much of a lever, but you'd be mistaken in thinking that people don't communicate their views via other avenues as well.
.
Those that get so irate at seeing Southampton criticised would do better putting their passion into pressuring the decision makers into rectifying things.

No people get on here to rant about their narrow minded viewpoints. Do the bother looking into what hammerson are developing or who they are targeting, do the research what a super casino is? No they make things up to suit their own viewpoints. Fast food outlets, mad drunk gambling addicts. Personally if some of the views on here are representative of Southampton then I would suggest that developers put their money else where.

andysaints007 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:
If we're lucky, Southampton can have the greatest concentration of casinos, bookies, cash-converters and HP stores like Brighthouse in the whole country.
.
Thanks to these fine people's predation on poverty we can then revel in our status as 'UK Capital of Misery'.
.
Much more catchy than that 'City of Culture' nonsense. We could run tours for Emos and Goths!

You obviously haven't been to the North East - shows how little you know!!

A touch of hyperbole maybe, I'll grant you that...

elvisimo wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

Depends what they are. If it's yet more low quality production line junk then it'll be totally pointless.
.
There are a handful of good (not posh, but decent) independent places in Southampton. Places that do well because word of mouth does their advertising for them - eg Georges, Kali Mirchi, Dock of the Bay. These places should be encouraged and offered incentives to open in the new 'prime' locations, as should well regarded outfits in Winchester, Dorset etc.

Lets get behind anyone who wants to invest in southampton. West quay phase 3 will have a great line up, seen who they are speaking to and it's spot on. If someone wants to build a super casino then brilliant. Get on with it. Enough armchair moaning. If people don't like it, live elsewhere.

"If people don't like it, live elsewhere."
.
That's the spirit! lol
.
So people should accept their home-town as a sub-mediocre dive, or otherwise just go elsewhere?
.
How defeatist...!
.
Some of us think that this City has a lot of unrealised potential, and would rather make that clear to those in power, than feign pride in a place that has suffered from an utter failure of leadership and vision for many years. The Echo's comments aren't much of a lever, but you'd be mistaken in thinking that people don't communicate their views via other avenues as well.
.
Those that get so irate at seeing Southampton criticised would do better putting their passion into pressuring the decision makers into rectifying things.

No people get on here to rant about their narrow minded viewpoints. Do the bother looking into what hammerson are developing or who they are targeting, do the research what a super casino is? No they make things up to suit their own viewpoints. Fast food outlets, mad drunk gambling addicts. Personally if some of the views on here are representative of Southampton then I would suggest that developers put their money else where.

"Do the research what a super casino is?"
.
It's a place that takes money from people with a problem. Those of us that have seen other families destroyed by casino gambling are well aware of what they are.
.
And if anyone thinks that a 'super' version is somehow different - Louis Theroux's Vegas documentary is very illuminating...

andysaints007 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:
If we're lucky, Southampton can have the greatest concentration of casinos, bookies, cash-converters and HP stores like Brighthouse in the whole country.
.
Thanks to these fine people's predation on poverty we can then revel in our status as 'UK Capital of Misery'.
.
Much more catchy than that 'City of Culture' nonsense. We could run tours for Emos and Goths!

You obviously haven't been to the North East - shows how little you know!!

The North East is less of a shithole than Southampton, and yes, I have been there.

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:
Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though.
My last three words:
Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol...
.
There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer.
.
And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

The words 'city' and 'enough' should never go together. Go tell that to people who live in proper cities. The only thing Southampton has 'enough' of is an all-pervading shroud of depression and terminal mediocrity.

03alpe01 wrote:

kingnotail wrote:

Rjhsoton wrote:
why do we need more hotels in an area that already has 6 already and more planned
give something that the residents want not the council's rich m8's

Hotels that serve little purpose more than single night stays for cruise passengers.

I can really picture all the fun that families will now be able to have in this area. A strip club, a super casino and whole lot of drunk people! It's the perfect place for families! And they weren't expecting this, because the Tourist Information Centre is closed.

Exactly. Sh1thampton excels itself as always.

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

But it's always 'grim' up north, isn't it, and always so wonderful down south? Biggest lie ever told. Case in point: Southampton. Makes even Sunderland and Hull look like Tokyo.

IronLady2010 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Presumably there is a way to improve facilities in Soton and that is to have referendum as to what the population would like.
Assuming there is a majority, Council funds could then be used to pump prime the investment as Portsmouth Tax payers had to do with the Spinnaker Tower, Liverpool with their Cruise Terminal and Eastleigh with the Cricket Ground investment (altho I don't think any of these had direct public support)
Problem is, I think, we would all have different priorities and there would be many concerned about funds being diverted from essential services

How much would a referendum cost? We've been down that road..............

I would certainly not be in favour of a referendum for the reasons you state.
What I was trying to put over, in a rather clumsy fashion, was that we all have differing views on the way forward for Southampton and the only way to get a reasonable concensus would be through (an impractical and costly) referendum.
A while ago Soton City Council produced a blueprint to develop the city, primarily the waterfront from Royal Pier to the old Meridian TV studios.
If implemented the plans would, in my humble opinion, transformed the city.
However the major stumbling block is accessing the cash to pay for it!!!.

Yes and people's lives ruined by drugs, booze, poor diet, lack of exercise etc etc etc so let's just cater for the minority. Go and have a l

elvisimo wrote:
Yes and people's lives ruined by drugs, booze, poor diet, lack of exercise etc etc etc so let's just cater for the minority. Go and have a l

Your comment made me think about George Orwell's book, 'The Road to Wigan Pier' in which he commented upon the building of prestigious Civic Offices (in Barnsley I recollect) in the 1930's when a lot of the inhabitants were living hand to mouth during the recession.
Nowadays the people of Barnsley would look upon this building as part of their heritage and not give a thought to how the money used in building the edifice could have helped
alleviate some of the problems of their forefathers.
A great many of the iconic buildings around the world were provided for the original benefit of the minority to the detriment of the majority.
Unfortunately that is the way it seems to work in our world

Raxx wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

cantthinkofone wrote:

03alpe01 wrote: Oooh yes please, really think we need another casino in that area, especially as one recently shut down. This will really give us something different to do in Southampton. I mean, what with Watermark WestQuay bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, the food factory as well which is down that way, this, and the Royal Thai Pier on Mayflower Park we must have at least 20 restaurants here! Plus all the numerous fast food outlets that are in the city centre. At first I thought that this could have been another bogus story, but then when I saw the words "luxury flats" I realised, nope this is real and we are in Southampton. I'd love to see what they would use the indoor arena for though. My last three words: Ice Rink anyone?

Very flexible use of the word 'restaurant' there lol... . There are very few decent restaurants in Southampton centre unfortunately. The vast majority are poor quality chains reliant on combi ovens and fryers - with ingredients defrosted from the walk-in freezer. . And before anyone starts about affordability - good quality independent restaurants using fresh ingredients often cost *less* than these chains, because they don't have such an outlay on marketing and branding.

But with the proposed Watermark scheme bringing upto 15/16 restaurants, do you not think that this is enough for one city?

Depends what they are. If it's yet more low quality production line junk then it'll be totally pointless. . There are a handful of good (not posh, but decent) independent places in Southampton. Places that do well because word of mouth does their advertising for them - eg Georges, Kali Mirchi, Dock of the Bay. These places should be encouraged and offered incentives to open in the new 'prime' locations, as should well regarded outfits in Winchester, Dorset etc.

Lets get behind anyone who wants to invest in southampton. West quay phase 3 will have a great line up, seen who they are speaking to and it's spot on. If someone wants to build a super casino then brilliant. Get on with it. Enough armchair moaning. If people don't like it, live elsewhere.

"If people don't like it, live elsewhere." . That's the spirit! lol . So people should accept their home-town as a sub-mediocre dive, or otherwise just go elsewhere? . How defeatist...! . Some of us think that this City has a lot of unrealised potential, and would rather make that clear to those in power, than feign pride in a place that has suffered from an utter failure of leadership and vision for many years. The Echo's comments aren't much of a lever, but you'd be mistaken in thinking that people don't communicate their views via other avenues as well. . Those that get so irate at seeing Southampton criticised would do better putting their passion into pressuring the decision makers into rectifying things.

No people get on here to rant about their narrow minded viewpoints. Do the bother looking into what hammerson are developing or who they are targeting, do the research what a super casino is? No they make things up to suit their own viewpoints. Fast food outlets, mad drunk gambling addicts. Personally if some of the views on here are representative of Southampton then I would suggest that developers put their money else where.

"Do the research what a super casino is?" . It's a place that takes money from people with a problem. Those of us that have seen other families destroyed by casino gambling are well aware of what they are. . And if anyone thinks that a 'super' version is somehow different - Louis Theroux's Vegas documentary is very illuminating...

Yes and people's lives ruined by drugs, booze, poor diet, lack of exercise etc etc etc so let's just cater for the minority. Go and have a look at one of these casinos.

phil maccavity wrote:

elvisimo wrote:
Yes and people's lives ruined by drugs, booze, poor diet, lack of exercise etc etc etc so let's just cater for the minority. Go and have a l

Your comment made me think about George Orwell's book, 'The Road to Wigan Pier' in which he commented upon the building of prestigious Civic Offices (in Barnsley I recollect) in the 1930's when a lot of the inhabitants were living hand to mouth during the recession.
Nowadays the people of Barnsley would look upon this building as part of their heritage and not give a thought to how the money used in building the edifice could have helped
alleviate some of the problems of their forefathers.
A great many of the iconic buildings around the world were provided for the original benefit of the minority to the detriment of the majority.
Unfortunately that is the way it seems to work in our world

Not many people have read that book phil, i found it a nice book to read

elvisimo wrote:

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Please shut up or change the record

You can not change the staute laws and rules that apply.
Mayflower park as rights right down to the water edge that is stute law, the park as conditions set on this land that there is to be no buildings apart from small buildings like where you can take a leak or a place to get refreshments, the park as a time limit for traffic but people on foot can enter 24 hours a day, the park can be closed for 10 days in a year (meant to be for mainaince work but the boat show uses this time slot).
To break these conditions will mean the park will be handed back to the real owners who will in turn enforce the park conditions and what this land was meant for.

andysaints007 wrote:

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Go away d*ckhead

looks like you can not debate, and results calling people names when you know you have no arguement to put foreward.

southy wrote:

andysaints007 wrote:

southy wrote:
Any land reclaimed infront of Mayflower park can not be built on, as it would automatically become part of Mayflower park and would have the same rules applied to it.

Go away d*ckhead

looks like you can not debate, and results calling people names when you know you have no arguement to put foreward.

If the council want to develop the land, they will find a way. Seriously, how can someone get so worked up over a miserable strip of grass and a car park, overlooking what has to be one of Britain's very worst waterside views? The whole area is a dump in absolutely dire need of redevelopment? I really do wonder what the cruise passengers think when confronted with the abysmal sight of Southampton...

They can't not with out breaking stute law.
and break the condition that was set on the park when the land was given to the People of Southampton would mean the land returning back to the orginal owners.
The Council is only the gaurdians to the park on behave of the people of southampton, they are there to make sure the park rules are not broken even by there selfs

southy wrote:
They can't not with out breaking stute law.
and break the condition that was set on the park when the land was given to the People of Southampton would mean the land returning back to the orginal owners.
The Council is only the gaurdians to the park on behave of the people of southampton, they are there to make sure the park rules are not broken even by there selfs

I can barely even be bothered to sift through the truly abysmal English. But, ok, you just keep telling yourself that mate. You can stand there on your own on the day the bulldozers move in (with your poorly-spelt placard no doubt), while everybody else delights in the knowledge that at last this pointless, ugly piece of wasteland is finally being redeveloped...

southy wrote:
They can't not with out breaking stute law.
and break the condition that was set on the park when the land was given to the People of Southampton would mean the land returning back to the orginal owners.
The Council is only the gaurdians to the park on behave of the people of southampton, they are there to make sure the park rules are not broken even by there selfs

Southy
For your information the owner of Mayflower Park is Soton City Council who inherited the land from the old Soton Borough Council who acquired the land when it was in-filled in the 1920's as part of the Western Docks expansion.
The foreshore is owned by the Crown Estate who will provide a 150 year lease to the City Council if the Royal Pier Development scheme goes ahead.
The only other statute relating to Mayflower Park is the Hampshire Act of 1983 Section 60 which was amended by the Soton Boat Show Act of 1997. The Public Health Amendment Act of 1890 is also relevant.
I am sure if you read all these documents you will understand exactly what the terms of reference relating to Mayflower Park are rather than relying on your misguided assumptions

elvisimo wrote:

230 repeat please wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

No I just make things up. Mad lies. Either that or I don't live in cloud cuckoo land. Credit check any of the 10 planet ice holding companies. Then tell me how a developer could afford to buy land, build an ice rink and let it to an operator without their bank manager shooting them.
Get in the real world.

Since you claim to do this for a living, you must realise that most of the ice rink developers and operators, (including Planet Ice) work with the councils, and lease the land rather than buying, so they can reduce their development costs.
Proactive councils, such as Guildford and Swindon even develop and operate the leisure facilities. In Guildford at the Spectrum Leisure Centre, which has bowling, ice rink and swimming on one site, they regularly do "Child goes free with paying adult" days, and the centre still makes a profit. I believe Swindon is also in profit. Unfortunately, although we have fabulous outdoor leisure areas in Southampton, such as the Sports Centre, Common, central Parks etc there is very little for people, especally families with children to do indoors during the bad weather, which we seem to be increasingly getting.
I am concerned that the focus of all of the recently proposed developments in this City are restaurants, flats and hotels, presumably because they expect us all to be so obese from all of our eating out that we have to waddle to bed nearby!
In the real world, very few restaurants are of the quality to attract visitors from further afield to the city, and Super Casinos are great for occasional big nights out, but would people visiting Southampton to go to the casino spend money anywhere else in the city? I doubt it.
I regularly take my family to Swindon, Basingstoke and Guildford where we can do any number of healthy activities on one site, and the whole family is entertained for a day inside one building. Something like this would give all of the students and young people in the city something better to do than the endless bars they are currently offered.
I think the council should give the contract to Rank and make one of the conditions that they provide an indoor arena that could be used as an ice rink. Now that would be a sweet irony!

Think about what you write. Operators and developers are two separate entities. No one can afford to build some ing in the current market and then let it to a paper thin covenant like planet ice. Unfundable

I can assure you I thought carefully about what I wrote, I'm only sorry you didn't understand, but in clarification, at no time do I state or even imply that develpers and operators are the same.
The fact is that some councils, (even in this recession) are pressing ahead with leisure developments, recognising the health benefits of exercise and the money to be made from the leisure industry. Several councils are involved in both the development and operation of these complexes, which are run profitably.
Other councils, are negotiating with developers, such as Ice Rink Company Ltd, to build rinks which are operated by Silverblades, or Planet Ice on complexes incorporating hotel and "restaurant" chains, such as Premier Inn, Nandos and Frankie & Bennys. The chains employ their own construction firms and operate their businesses, on council owned land. The council benefits from rates, and lease payments. It may not be to everyone's taste, but it is a model that works, and there would be demand from the increasing numbers of students and young people in Southampton.
The business activities of Silverblades, Planet Ice and Ice Rink Company Ltd may well be delicate and intertwined, but they should not be decried if it enables city residents to benefit from improved leisure facilities.

phil maccavity wrote:

southy wrote:
They can't not with out breaking stute law.
and break the condition that was set on the park when the land was given to the People of Southampton would mean the land returning back to the orginal owners.
The Council is only the gaurdians to the park on behave of the people of southampton, they are there to make sure the park rules are not broken even by there selfs

Southy
For your information the owner of Mayflower Park is Soton City Council who inherited the land from the old Soton Borough Council who acquired the land when it was in-filled in the 1920's as part of the Western Docks expansion.
The foreshore is owned by the Crown Estate who will provide a 150 year lease to the City Council if the Royal Pier Development scheme goes ahead.
The only other statute relating to Mayflower Park is the Hampshire Act of 1983 Section 60 which was amended by the Soton Boat Show Act of 1997. The Public Health Amendment Act of 1890 is also relevant.
I am sure if you read all these documents you will understand exactly what the terms of reference relating to Mayflower Park are rather than relying on your misguided assumptions

It's like trying to tell David Icke the world isn't really populated by sinister shape-shifting lizards who occupy all positions of power..

230 repeat please wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

230 repeat please wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

No I just make things up. Mad lies. Either that or I don't live in cloud cuckoo land. Credit check any of the 10 planet ice holding companies. Then tell me how a developer could afford to buy land, build an ice rink and let it to an operator without their bank manager shooting them.
Get in the real world.

Since you claim to do this for a living, you must realise that most of the ice rink developers and operators, (including Planet Ice) work with the councils, and lease the land rather than buying, so they can reduce their development costs.
Proactive councils, such as Guildford and Swindon even develop and operate the leisure facilities. In Guildford at the Spectrum Leisure Centre, which has bowling, ice rink and swimming on one site, they regularly do "Child goes free with paying adult" days, and the centre still makes a profit. I believe Swindon is also in profit. Unfortunately, although we have fabulous outdoor leisure areas in Southampton, such as the Sports Centre, Common, central Parks etc there is very little for people, especally families with children to do indoors during the bad weather, which we seem to be increasingly getting.
I am concerned that the focus of all of the recently proposed developments in this City are restaurants, flats and hotels, presumably because they expect us all to be so obese from all of our eating out that we have to waddle to bed nearby!
In the real world, very few restaurants are of the quality to attract visitors from further afield to the city, and Super Casinos are great for occasional big nights out, but would people visiting Southampton to go to the casino spend money anywhere else in the city? I doubt it.
I regularly take my family to Swindon, Basingstoke and Guildford where we can do any number of healthy activities on one site, and the whole family is entertained for a day inside one building. Something like this would give all of the students and young people in the city something better to do than the endless bars they are currently offered.
I think the council should give the contract to Rank and make one of the conditions that they provide an indoor arena that could be used as an ice rink. Now that would be a sweet irony!

Think about what you write. Operators and developers are two separate entities. No one can afford to build some ing in the current market and then let it to a paper thin covenant like planet ice. Unfundable

I can assure you I thought carefully about what I wrote, I'm only sorry you didn't understand, but in clarification, at no time do I state or even imply that develpers and operators are the same.
The fact is that some councils, (even in this recession) are pressing ahead with leisure developments, recognising the health benefits of exercise and the money to be made from the leisure industry. Several councils are involved in both the development and operation of these complexes, which are run profitably.
Other councils, are negotiating with developers, such as Ice Rink Company Ltd, to build rinks which are operated by Silverblades, or Planet Ice on complexes incorporating hotel and "restaurant" chains, such as Premier Inn, Nandos and Frankie & Bennys. The chains employ their own construction firms and operate their businesses, on council owned land. The council benefits from rates, and lease payments. It may not be to everyone's taste, but it is a model that works, and there would be demand from the increasing numbers of students and young people in Southampton.
The business activities of Silverblades, Planet Ice and Ice Rink Company Ltd may well be delicate and intertwined, but they should not be decried if it enables city residents to benefit from improved leisure facilities.

That's how bad Southampton is, it doesn't ever have a decent Nando's! Just a small corner in a shoping mall food court that shut's at 7.30pm! If you can't even get the bog-standard stuff right, what chance do you have with anything better?!?!

kingnotail wrote:

230 repeat please wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

230 repeat please wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

elvisimo wrote:

03alpe01 wrote:

phil maccavity wrote:
Bev
As I understand it the Council (and other Business Organisations in the City) would very much like to have a large Arena type facility in the city.
However although there has been interest expressed by potential developers the capital cost is very high.
Elsewhere in the country (especially the north) there are grants available to underwrite the cost (eg Liverpool got around £130m out of £150m build cost for their very nice Liverpool Arena)
The City Council (of whatever political persuasion) comes in for a lot of stick but they do have to rely primarily on outside investment.
I guess casino's etc may not be everyone's cup of tea but they will provide employment and revenue to the city via Rates

Another question I feel as though we should we asking ourselves is why don't these sorts of developers i.e. Arena Developers/Ice Rink Developers, or just really big attraction developers want to invest in Southampton? You only have to look at Basingstoke's Leisure Park to see that they have not only the ice rink, but they also have (from Summer 2013) a brand new Airkix Indoor Skydiving dome, which is something that Southampton couldn't even dream of getting. The fact that it's getting built shows that there are developers around willing to invest in this type of leisure, however at the moment nobody wants to invest in Southampton, and we should be asking them why? What makes Basingstoke a better place to invest in than Southampton?

Could you perhaps name a few of these arena and ice rink developers. In fact just one will do that is active in the current market ?

Planet Ice, Silverblades, Absolutely Ice

Developers - not operators. Planet ice, the guys who went bust? Pre packed and separate holding companies. Absolutely ice council funded. So any developer for ice rinks or arenas currently active?
Ps. I know the answer, it's what I do , or try to do for a living

So THAT'S why Planet Ice just opened up a new rink in Uttoxeter then seeing as they went bust?
If you already know the answer, then why ask the question?

No I just make things up. Mad lies. Either that or I don't live in cloud cuckoo land. Credit check any of the 10 planet ice holding companies. Then tell me how a developer could afford to buy land, build an ice rink and let it to an operator without their bank manager shooting them.
Get in the real world.

Since you claim to do this for a living, you must realise that most of the ice rink developers and operators, (including Planet Ice) work with the councils, and lease the land rather than buying, so they can reduce their development costs.
Proactive councils, such as Guildford and Swindon even develop and operate the leisure facilities. In Guildford at the Spectrum Leisure Centre, which has bowling, ice rink and swimming on one site, they regularly do "Child goes free with paying adult" days, and the centre still makes a profit. I believe Swindon is also in profit. Unfortunately, although we have fabulous outdoor leisure areas in Southampton, such as the Sports Centre, Common, central Parks etc there is very little for people, especally families with children to do indoors during the bad weather, which we seem to be increasingly getting.
I am concerned that the focus of all of the recently proposed developments in this City are restaurants, flats and hotels, presumably because they expect us all to be so obese from all of our eating out that we have to waddle to bed nearby!
In the real world, very few restaurants are of the quality to attract visitors from further afield to the city, and Super Casinos are great for occasional big nights out, but would people visiting Southampton to go to the casino spend money anywhere else in the city? I doubt it.
I regularly take my family to Swindon, Basingstoke and Guildford where we can do any number of healthy activities on one site, and the whole family is entertained for a day inside one building. Something like this would give all of the students and young people in the city something better to do than the endless bars they are currently offered.
I think the council should give the contract to Rank and make one of the conditions that they provide an indoor arena that could be used as an ice rink. Now that would be a sweet irony!

Think about what you write. Operators and developers are two separate entities. No one can afford to build some ing in the current market and then let it to a paper thin covenant like planet ice. Unfundable

I can assure you I thought carefully about what I wrote, I'm only sorry you didn't understand, but in clarification, at no time do I state or even imply that develpers and operators are the same.
The fact is that some councils, (even in this recession) are pressing ahead with leisure developments, recognising the health benefits of exercise and the money to be made from the leisure industry. Several councils are involved in both the development and operation of these complexes, which are run profitably.
Other councils, are negotiating with developers, such as Ice Rink Company Ltd, to build rinks which are operated by Silverblades, or Planet Ice on complexes incorporating hotel and "restaurant" chains, such as Premier Inn, Nandos and Frankie & Bennys. The chains employ their own construction firms and operate their businesses, on council owned land. The council benefits from rates, and lease payments. It may not be to everyone's taste, but it is a model that works, and there would be demand from the increasing numbers of students and young people in Southampton.
The business activities of Silverblades, Planet Ice and Ice Rink Company Ltd may well be delicate and intertwined, but they should not be decried if it enables city residents to benefit from improved leisure facilities.

That's how bad Southampton is, it doesn't ever have a decent Nando's! Just a small corner in a shoping mall food court that shut's at 7.30pm! If you can't even get the bog-standard stuff right, what chance do you have with anything better?!?!

*shopping

What Southampton needs more than anything else is events, clubs, and societies. If you look at the 'listings' for other cities there's a tonne of stuff on every weekend. When I moved back to Southampton many years ago now I remember how shocked I was that there was practically nothing.
.
These organisations need the facilities to prosper - community spaces that as well as simple functional rooms include stages, studios etc - available at a minimal price (sufficient to cover costs but no more). They also need encouragement and incentivisation - a high-profile campaign by the council to help new start-up organisations, offering free publicity and planning advice.
.
Boost the standard of life in the city, boost the reputation of the city, and give the people something to alleviate the boredom, decreasing petty crime and anti-social behaviour. Once the facilities are built/converted, then 90% of it would be powered by citizens, so the cost would be minimal.